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Jza
Joined: 14 Jul 2001
Posts: 894
Location: USA |
Question of ethics to Jigga, Killa, Axolotl.
Ok I know you guys are hockey fans and I love to watch ESPN. I don't know much about hockey like you guys but I saw that guy catch a a right hook from behind and go down face first into the ice.
Now they're making a big deal about it. While I agree it was wrong to follow a guy around like that and then belt him from behind... I think it wouldn't have been a big deal if the punch landed and the guy turned around and started fighting back. I hate how people only say it's wrong when something bad happens.
Haven't there been less publicized moments in hockey involving some guys hitting others with their hockey sticks? I'd rather catch a right hand than get wacked with that stick. I do agree they should get in trouble for hitting a guy with the stick. Imagine a baseball player pissed off after grounding out and bashing the opposing teams first baseman. It's ok if a Mets player gets bashed (You reading this you know who?) hehe.
I think guys are gonna get hit with sticks playing hockey because it's the nature of the game, but I still think what that guy did isn't any worse than someone smackin a guy in the face with their stick on purpose.
Anyway, just watched that last night and was wondering how hockey fans took it.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 9:57 am |
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Axolotl
Joined: 14 Sep 2000
Posts: 3772
Location: Vancouver BC |
It was the absolutely worst thing that could of happened in that scenario. He obviously didn't expect the guy to be knocked out from the punch, nor did he even realize that he was when he was falling down. You could do that 1000 times and you would not break someones neck. You are right about it being a big deal because something bad happened. If the guy didn't get hurt he would of got nothing for it. If the guy just turtled, he might of got a game suspension for it
However, it did happen and there is no excuse for punching someone from behind. You should always turn a guy around first so he can at least defend himself. So Bertuzzi has to deal with the fact that what he did was still idiotic, which will be a big suspension, and a suit from Moore. I don't know what to think about criminal charges yet.
There have been several worse things that ended up with nothing because someone didnt get hurt. The whole thing that started the Ottawa/Philadelphia brawl was the fact that Havlat took a 2 handed swing to Recchi's face. It was ridiculous and the intent was way worse than Bertuzzi's.
Yes, I wish they would take guys like Havlat and suspend them for huge amounts like 25-30 games, along with some big fines. People who can't control their temper enough to not use a stick as a weapon don't deserve to play.
Anyways. I feel bad for bertuzzi, but he did it and now has to deal with it. Moore's the one with the broken neck.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 10:12 am |
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WarIINewBiE
Joined: 30 Jan 2004
Posts: 102
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How bout...
just getting rid of the whole fight thing in hockey? I don't know the sport very well but I've seen a few cases where the ref would line 2 guys up and let them go at each for other for a minute or 2 before sending both to the box. I really don't understand that portion of the sport!
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 10:54 am |
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KillaBoBilla
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 740
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quote:
Originally posted by Axolotl
There have been several worse things that ended up with nothing because someone didnt get hurt. The whole thing that started the Ottawa/Philadelphia brawl was the fact that Havlat took a 2 handed swing to Recchi's face. It was ridiculous and the intent was way worse than Bertuzzi's.
Yes, I wish they would take guys like Havlat and suspend them for huge amounts like 25-30 games, along with some big fines. People who can't control their temper enough to not use a stick as a weapon don't deserve to play.
You clearly did not see what Havlat did. Or, if you did, you are a Flyers fan and can only see it from the perspective of a Flyers fan.
For those of you who don't know, while Martin Havlat was in the Flyers zone trying to keep the puck in, Mark Recchi was harrassing him trying to get the puck up. Havlat then got frustrated and cross-checked Recchi in the face. I am by no means defending what Havlat did, I think it was stupid. But by no means was it a 2 handed swing. Recchi was not even hurt on the play.
This brings me to Jza's post. I don't know what I think about this whole Bertuzzi thing yet. Yes, it was dirty. Yes, he should be suspended for a long time. No, Moore did not deserve to break vertebrae. However, at the same time, some of this can be placed on the NHL's shoulders. The instigator rule can be blamed in part for this, as can the general lack of respect for players in the league.
As far as the punishment goes, this is often talked about. Should Bertuzzi get 10 games, 20 games, should he be out as long as long as Moore is? Should be be suspended only for games against the Avs? Who knows? The NHL is going downhill fast and turning into the XHL.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:27 am |
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Skechers
Joined: 23 Feb 2003
Posts: 6077
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the guy needs to be punched in the nuts because he did a pansy thing.... give me a break, what did he think was going to happen after he knocks someone out from behind? hes hould go to jail for being such a p*ssy
haha yeah i heard about the other incident too, i also think he is a pansy and what not and the same thing should happen to him..
why did he hit him in the face in teh first place? didn't he say some kind of racial remark
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 1:13 pm |
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Axolotl
Joined: 14 Sep 2000
Posts: 3772
Location: Vancouver BC |
quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
For those of you who don't know, while Martin Havlat was in the Flyers zone trying to keep the puck in, Mark Recchi was harrassing him trying to get the puck up. Havlat then got frustrated and cross-checked Recchi in the face. I am by no means defending what Havlat did, I think it was stupid. But by no means was it a 2 handed swing.
Recchi was not even hurt on the play.
I hate the flyers. One of my most disliked teams. I hope Bob Clarke gets hit by a car. I don't mind Ottawa.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 1:30 pm |
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Jza
Joined: 14 Jul 2001
Posts: 894
Location: USA |
quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
The NHL is going downhill fast and turning into the XHL.
Holy... If a fan of my sport said something like that man, I'd be trying to find a way to regain my fans respect. The XHL! That was brutal Killa.
..they gonna have scantily clad girls skating around the ice between periods now?
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 1:33 pm |
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cooldip
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 75
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quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
You clearly did not see what Havlat did. Or, if you did, you are a Flyers fan and can only see it from the perspective of a Flyers fan.
For those of you who don't know, while Martin Havlat was in the Flyers zone trying to keep the puck in, Mark Recchi was harrassing him trying to get the puck up. Havlat then got frustrated and cross-checked Recchi in the face. I am by no means defending what Havlat did, I think it was stupid. But by no means was it a 2 handed swing. Recchi was not even hurt on the play.
This brings me to Jza's post. I don't know what I think about this whole Bertuzzi thing yet. Yes, it was dirty. Yes, he should be suspended for a long time. No, Moore did not deserve to break vertebrae. However, at the same time, some of this can be placed on the NHL's shoulders. The instigator rule can be blamed in part for this, as can the general lack of respect for players in the league.
Not you too killa, anytime there's any injury in the league someone is quick to blame the instigator rule...
There is no question who is to blame here, he stated publicly that he was gonna get moore, he didn't do anything in colorada im assuming because of the unfair atmosphere to make his move. He waited until the right time and made his move. I can't think of such a viscious planned attack in the past you try to think of one...
Bertuzzi is a fucking maniac and shouldn't be playing hockey...
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 2:30 pm |
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KillaBoBilla
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 740
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quote:
Originally posted by cooldip
quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
You clearly did not see what Havlat did. Or, if you did, you are a Flyers fan and can only see it from the perspective of a Flyers fan.
For those of you who don't know, while Martin Havlat was in the Flyers zone trying to keep the puck in, Mark Recchi was harrassing him trying to get the puck up. Havlat then got frustrated and cross-checked Recchi in the face. I am by no means defending what Havlat did, I think it was stupid. But by no means was it a 2 handed swing. Recchi was not even hurt on the play.
This brings me to Jza's post. I don't know what I think about this whole Bertuzzi thing yet. Yes, it was dirty. Yes, he should be suspended for a long time. No, Moore did not deserve to break vertebrae. However, at the same time, some of this can be placed on the NHL's shoulders. The instigator rule can be blamed in part for this, as can the general lack of respect for players in the league.
Not you too killa, anytime there's any injury in the league someone is quick to blame the instigator rule...
There is no question who is to blame here, he stated publicly that he was gonna get moore, he didn't do anything in colorada im assuming because of the unfair atmosphere to make his move. He waited until the right time and made his move. I can't think of such a viscious planned attack in the past you try to think of one...
Bertuzzi is a fucking maniac and shouldn't be playing hockey...
yo cool... I am coming over tomorrow to watch Ottawa pisspump the Flames. I'll bring Kleenex for ya, cause when my boys take out Jarome Inigla, you are gonna cry.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 3:40 pm |
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ThreeUp3Down
Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Posts: 627
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..they gonna have scantily clad girls skating around the ice between periods now?
More enertaining then the Zamboni.
What he did was wrong and a long suspension is in hand but I think the assault charges are too much.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 4:13 pm |
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$hazm
Joined: 24 Mar 2001
Posts: 1882
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That was the second time Bertuzzi pulled that kind of shit. The main issue isn't even that he puched some guy in the back of the head, its that the guy has a fractured neck as a result. the first time he wasent even supended because nobody got hurt, and it bearly made the news. I can't remember the exact circumstance of the first incident but I remember him doing something worse than punching someone in the back of the head. Maybe if he was properly punished the first time this whole thing would have been avoided.
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 4:53 pm |
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cooldip
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 75
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quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
yo cool... I am coming over tomorrow to watch Ottawa pisspump the Flames. I'll bring Kleenex for ya, cause when my boys take out Jarome Inigla, you are gonna cry.
oh boy your'e gonna eat those words after ottawa suffers an avs style beatdown.....
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Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:48 pm |
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JiGGa_MaN
Joined: 26 Nov 2002
Posts: 10014
Location: Future home of the Stanley cup, Ottawa |
quote:
Originally posted by Axolotl
It was the absolutely worst thing that could of happened in that scenario. He obviously didn't expect the guy to be knocked out from the punch, nor did he even realize that he was when he was falling down. You could do that 1000 times and you would not break someones neck. You are right about it being a big deal because something bad happened. If the guy didn't get hurt he would of got nothing for it. If the guy just turtled, he might of got a game suspension for it
However, it did happen and there is no excuse for punching someone from behind. You should always turn a guy around first so he can at least defend himself. So Bertuzzi has to deal with the fact that what he did was still idiotic, which will be a big suspension, and a suit from Moore. I don't know what to think about criminal charges yet.
There have been several worse things that ended up with nothing because someone didnt get hurt. The whole thing that started the Ottawa/Philadelphia brawl was the fact that Havlat took a 2 handed swing to Recchi's face. It was ridiculous and the intent was way worse than Bertuzzi's.
Yes, I wish they would take guys like Havlat and suspend them for huge amounts like 25-30 games, along with some big fines. People who can't control their temper enough to not use a stick as a weapon don't deserve to play.
Anyways. I feel bad for bertuzzi, but he did it and now has to deal with it. Moore's the one with the broken neck.
I dont know how you can think what Havlat did was anywhere near as bad. Havlat cross checked Recchi in the upper chest, after being hooked by him for about 40 seconds straight. Obviously, it was a cheap move, and a stupid play.
I wouldnt , however, compare Havlat's outburst, with a full on blow to the temple from behind - obviously intentionally - and ride a guys face into the ice. He didnt look to be struggling in trying not to throw his face into the ground. Its the worst thing I've ever seen in Hockey Violence, and he should be banned. Especially when McSorley got banned for far less than this.
I dont feel sorry for Bertuzzi at all. He's always had a stupid temper, and it finally might have caused someone their career. What a bum. Embarassing to the sport of Hockey.
_________________
We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
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Thu Mar 11, 2004 12:09 am |
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eS[MaGe]
Joined: 13 Jun 2003
Posts: 1434
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Go Penguins!
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Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:37 pm |
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cooldip
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
Posts: 75
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quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
yo cool... I am coming over tomorrow to watch Ottawa pisspump the Flames. I'll bring Kleenex for ya, cause when my boys take out Jarome Inigla, you are gonna cry.
Victim #1 of new-look flames beatdown......
OTTAWA
GG Killa
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Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:51 pm |
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JiGGa_MaN
Joined: 26 Nov 2002
Posts: 10014
Location: Future home of the Stanley cup, Ottawa |
quote:
Originally posted by cooldip
quote:
Originally posted by KillaBoBilla
yo cool... I am coming over tomorrow to watch Ottawa pisspump the Flames. I'll bring Kleenex for ya, cause when my boys take out Jarome Inigla, you are gonna cry.
Victim #1 of new-look flames beatdown......
OTTAWA
GG Killa
yeah, we didnt play too well. You can tell the Senators are anxious for the playoffs. I think winning the presidents cup last year tired them alot, and they are going to dog it a little down the stretch.
_________________
We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
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Fri Mar 12, 2004 1:20 pm |
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x
Joined: 31 Oct 2001
Posts: 1634
Location: Athens, GA |
ZUG ZUG!
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Fri Mar 12, 2004 2:49 pm |
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