What do most of you do when you find a dual? Is it better to throw up a bunch of guard towers followed by cats/grunts, or to counter dual and maybe use a couple of towers? I've tried both, and win/lose with each about equally, although I usually lose to duals; just want to see you guys' opinions. This is also in 1v1 games. Thanks.

Whatever you do, don't counter dual. It's too late to do that.

I disagree. I think counter dualing can be quite effective in certain situations.

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Originally posted by Soth
I disagree. I think counter dualing can be quite effective in certain situations.

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I'll expand on my answer a bit more. Alot of times the dualer will chopout rush with a few grunts, making it a bit difficult for you if you dont rush hard enough; if you counter dual,you still have to have enough grunts to counter his, but not so many it will slow you down in the tech race. so im always looking for a chopout when dealing with a dualer to see if i have to deal with grunts. If you know a certain players style, then you can use that to your advantage; if you know they wont rush, you can 3 hall ; D

2 catting a dual is more risky in my opinion, simply because i think its alot easier for a dual to get a couple of inside cats and towers, and still out tech you. if they chopout rush, you have more chance of losing your cats, and still be behind; if you dont kill one of their bases or do massive damage then they'll outpower you. lots of things can go wrong. i used to only counter dual, learned from my mentor Oj ^^ ; D but ive seen people like nerzy ot a dual and just use grunts and break in, and out res/power the dualer; so sometimes you dont even need 2 cats or a counter dual.

i remember playing shxbraviet in a 1on1 where he dualed 9/11, so i counter dualed at 12/2 and 3; so a 3 hall ; D unfortunately, he chopout rushed and took out my hold at 12. but with soth-like playing, i forted at 3 and made an amazing comeback to win ; D am i the champ or what?!

w00t~! double post, never did that before

what if its a straight out cat/cannon dual?

Why would you chop out for grunts, all you gotta do is put your first rax on a wall with first deploy spot only on the outside.(see axo's dual rush strat guide)

If anyone chops out before they're ready to defend themselves then they don't deserve the win anyways.

Ax, if they straight cannon- cat you can probably sapp the shit outta them, that is if they do that in both cities. If they do cat in one and cannon in other, then you can cat the cannon city, and as long as you're quick they'll find them selves in a bad way for res.

And naturally if anyone towers only after being discovered in a 1v1 then you can tear them down with some basic OTing. Though a good player will fall back and cat or peon rep towers, odds are you're gonna choke them too much to go big. BTW this will NOT work if you don't scout the map for outside peons and\or third bases.
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Dr B was here.

And if I may expand on axo's comment that counter dualing is foolish, if you counter dual obviously you're too far behind, but like you said Soth, you could three hall to get bigger, however, though no disrespect to ShxBraviet, he was an idiot not to find you at 3.

A three hall is to0 easy to stop if you're a decent scouter.

I think brav just got cocky since he was running a dual.

And props to you for coming back in that game sOth
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Dr B was here.

You guys should learn how to counter dual. If you do then u will probably not be behind the straight dualer, especially if u annoy him with a couples of grunts.

Hehe..trying to sap the shit out of a dualer is a good way to die.

Thanks for your help guys . I think catting/rushing/OTing is probably pretty risky, since you will be way behind if you don't hurt them, like Soth said. However, when you counter dual and get a few grunts it is probably a little safer; if anything they will be outside your base lusting when you just got lust. Thanks for all the responses.

if the dual is a s9/9 dual then you should probably counter dual but make sure to not always do the same thing so people won't know if you're gonna cat or if you're counter dualing
a 9/11 dual is hard to beat either way, it's probably better to cat it though
a 4/5 dual just blows and you shouldn't have trouble killing it with ots/grunts/cats
drbrendo you are a no0b =/

or you can be like yahmon and always peonscout a dual =/

axo;... i dont think he was really asking how to beat a dual rush, i was just speaking in general because alot of people like to chopout a 9/11 standard dual with a few grunts. but personally id ot an outside rax with a couple of gts and counter dual or 2 cat; hell, maybe all i have to do is tower the other base a bit and power. either way, he has to get defense in both bases after trying to rush, and im way ahead of him. in theory anyway.

and like kanuks said, if you really know how to counter dual its a fine way to compete in late game vs a dual.

drbrendo, we arent really speaking of fastest which you normally play(at least im under that impression); i never counter dual on fastest because i always peon scout and ot/ cat a dual and power.. by the time hes lust, ive got like 3 exps ; D

an early cannon on a dual rush makes you resource poor, and frankly i dont understand why people do it. but if someone could teach me a good dual rush w/ cannon id be happy to change my opinion of it.

I would think I've worked harder on perfecting my dual (there are variations) than anyone else, although I don't always execute real well. I think it's as close as it can get to unbreakable. Forget about being the breaker, put the pressure on them and make them break your dual. By dualing you only have to play well real early, once you're fort it's a piece of cake. See me online and we'll work on things.
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Nedro
I'm a dualing machine™

You're right axo sapping is a good way to die against a dual, but like I said, this strat is only if your opponent is dumb enough to cat\cannon in both cities.

The reasoning behind this is: in order for them to pull this off they need to have spent all the money on two cannon towers, two barracks, and two catapults.

Under these rare and newbish circumstances the easist way to beat them is to go ahead and get sappers, because you'll be ahead of them anyways.

But hey thanks for actually reading what I wrote before insulting me.

Whoops that last post was me forgot to log in. <how embarassing>


Soth, I'm talking about faster speed, since this is really the only speed I 1v1 gowbne on.

and you're all right I am a no0b. forgive me for posting
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Dr B was here.

I think he means cat at one mine and cannon in the other.
No one builds two cannon towers, two barracks, and two catapults.

I wasn't trying to insult you, brendo. i apologize if i gave you that impression.

You need to go hold at about 11-13 peons and not have built ur mill in order to successfully beat a dual with a sapp. Which means u can't wait to see if your opponent makes a canon and a cat, because at this time you will already have 14+ peons and probably have spent too much wood on farms or upgrades to go hold quick. So sapping is kindda like taking a guess : you scout 9 and see a 9-s9 dual so u chose to sapp, which may be good if the dualer get 2 cats, fearing a cat rush, but can be ugly if the opponent start getting some grunts inside right after getting his first cat. In the second example, the dualer would easily crush the sapper. Sapping can be good if used rarely since no one will expect it. It may be good nowadays since i realized a lots of dualer get 2+ cats like faggots, but don't expect sapping to be very effective if everyone uses it since it would become more predictable.

quote:

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Originally posted by DrBrendo
Why would you chop out for grunts, all you gotta do is put your first rax on a wall with first deploy spot only on the outside.(see axo's dual rush strat guide)

If anyone chops out before they're ready to defend themselves then they don't deserve the win anyways.

Ax, if they straight cannon- cat you can probably sapp the shit outta them, that is if they do that in both cities. If they do cat in one and cannon in other, then you can cat the cannon city, and as long as you're quick they'll find them selves in a bad way for res.

And naturally if anyone towers only after being discovered in a 1v1 then you can tear them down with some basic OTing. Though a good player will fall back and cat or peon rep towers, odds are you're gonna choke them too much to go big. BTW this will NOT work if you don't scout the map for outside peons and\or third bases.

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just p scout and make a rax in their base and get owned like the newb i am.

k stunna

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Originally posted by Nedro
I would think I've worked harder on perfecting my dual (there are variations) than anyone else, although I don't always execute real well. I think it's as close as it can get to unbreakable. Forget about being the breaker, put the pressure on them and make them break your dual. By dualing you only have to play well real early, once you're fort it's a piece of cake. See me online and we'll work on things.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fast Luck
hassan-i-asher: majorin in takin pictures
dreamin bout wayne from catalina wine mixers
listen little friend stay outta the deep end
cuz you're less street than vampire weekend

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quote:

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Originally posted by Axolotl
Whatever you do, don't counter dual. It's too late to do that.

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quote:

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Originally posted by DrBrendo


Ax, if they straight cannon- cat you can probably sapp the shit outta them, that is if they do that in both cities. If they do cat in one and cannon in other, then you can cat the cannon city, and as long as you're quick they'll find them selves in a bad way for res..

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Or you could just always scout with 2 peons and the problem is resolved.

depends on if the dualer knows what he is doinG ...u can get away with anything if he doesnt know
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That depends on the situations and the progress of the combat.
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