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Mez
Joined: 01 Nov 2001
Posts: 299
Location: melb/vic/aus |
quote:
Originally posted by Sypher
NaDa vs Boxer is going to be a 1 sided rape imo. Boxer was having a hard time keeping up with macro against loner even when he was way ahead(Loner getting expo up slower and still having mroe SCVs than Boxer). Loner just played like shit, imo. Couple that with the fact that Boxer has years of experience of practicing and Loner didnt stand a chance.
NaDas timings and macro are way more proficient than Boxer. The games vs Leenock were just sick. He was keeping up on bases with zerg and his army never really fell behind. I honestly think that with the way the results have been going, NaDa has a huge chance to take this GSL down.
lol you have to be kidding me, nadas TvT in the earlier rounds have been atrocious, the last TvT he was so strategically unsound and he only won because the guy he played was horrible so he just won with pure macro alone. Yes his games vs leenock were much better but his TvT is so unimpressive.
Boxer wasn't "lacking on macro" he cut scv's for a timing push hence why he won the game at that exact point. Infact all of boxers TvT play has been far more strategically superior to nada.
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 4:13 pm |
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Sypher
Joined: 18 Sep 2000
Posts: 5698
Location: Detroit, MI |
quote:
Originally posted by Mez
lol you have to be kidding me, nadas TvT in the earlier rounds have been atrocious, the last TvT he was so strategically unsound and he only won because the guy he played was horrible so he just won with pure macro alone. Yes his games vs leenock were much better but his TvT is so unimpressive.
Boxer wasn't "lacking on macro" he cut scv's for a timing push hence why he won the game at that exact point. Infact all of boxers TvT play has been far more strategically superior to nada.
Nadas TvT is so impressive because of his macro. He definitely has the best macro in SC2 at the moment. Sure, his strategies are very straight forward and bland, but he wins pretty straight forwardly by superior macro. The longer the game goes, the chances of nada winning increases. Nada knows exactly what he needs to defend the cutesy strats that people like Boxer, TLO, and Loner use.
Boxer WAS lacking macro. He wasnt cutting SCVs for a timing attack. If he was, he wouldn't have taken a 3rd as he was moving out. The point of cutting SCVs is to be able to get the most units out as possible while constantly reinforcing. Why would you take a 3rd after cutting SCVs?
Boxer has always been known as a micro intensive player whose skill went down once mechanically sound players like iloveoov, Nada, and Savior came on the scene.
Macro wins games, not cutesy strats. The fact that Ro8 is bo5 only helps Nada.
Also, Nada has the advantage of being on the same team as TLO and HopeTorture. Between those two players, NaDa will have a shitload of practice vs all kinds of TvT strats and playstyles.
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"I tend to thougoughly enjoy my encounters significantly more with 120+ types, as I find them more stimulating. 100-110 people are okay too operating at full capacity." - Paper_Boy
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:45 pm |
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DrunkeN
Joined: 20 Jul 2001
Posts: 616
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lol....maybe we should just wait til the match plays out. I think it will be Epic one way or the other.
oh yeah TLO plays zerg a lerg now.
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Anti-Jabroni
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Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:30 am |
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x
Joined: 31 Oct 2001
Posts: 1634
Location: Athens, GA |
I thought NaDa was oGs, TLO TL, HopeTorture ST?
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Mon Nov 01, 2010 7:00 am |
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Mez
Joined: 01 Nov 2001
Posts: 299
Location: melb/vic/aus |
quote:
Originally posted by Sypher
\\
NaDa vs Boxer is going to be a 1 sided rape imo.
Well at least you got this part right.
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Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:44 am |
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Sypher
Joined: 18 Sep 2000
Posts: 5698
Location: Detroit, MI |
Nada played like a fucking idiot. T.T
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"I tend to thougoughly enjoy my encounters significantly more with 120+ types, as I find them more stimulating. 100-110 people are okay too operating at full capacity." - Paper_Boy
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Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:50 am |
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kublikhan
Joined: 11 Jul 2003
Posts: 2849
Location: Schaumburg, IL |
Boxer can do some sick things with a single banshee.....
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Give me a lever long enough and I shall move the world. - Archimedes
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Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:33 am |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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Marauders need their hp reduced =(
100hp for a unit that does so much damage would make even out the playing field a lot.
4 terrans in the semi's, 6 in the round of 8.
Something doesn't add up. Mules are also too strong--need an energy increase.
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Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:46 am |
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7VlesSiah
Joined: 16 Feb 2001
Posts: 2456
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They are just all around too strong. You could point to any unit except the reaper(which they actually nerfed) and make an argue for it being over powered. The least they should do is make marauder units slightly slower than marines so atleast a Terran needs to micro.
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Sat Nov 06, 2010 7:58 am |
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kublikhan
Joined: 11 Jul 2003
Posts: 2849
Location: Schaumburg, IL |
quote:
Originally posted by Kith-Kanin
Marauders need their hp reduced =(
100hp for a unit that does so much damage would make even out the playing field a lot.
4 terrans in the semi's, 6 in the round of 8.
Something doesn't add up. Mules are also too strong--need an energy increase.
Huh? There are 3 terrans in the semi's.
_________________
Give me a lever long enough and I shall move the world. - Archimedes
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Sat Nov 06, 2010 12:38 pm |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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quote:
Originally posted by kublikhan
quote:
Originally posted by Kith-Kanin
Marauders need their hp reduced =(
100hp for a unit that does so much damage would make even out the playing field a lot.
4 terrans in the semi's, 6 in the round of 8.
Something doesn't add up. Mules are also too strong--need an energy increase.
Huh? There are 3 terrans in the semi's.
Mm didn't realize nestea was a zerg player. Oh well. Regardless there were still 6 out of 8 terrans in the quarters. I still think marauders are too strong right now or too cheap. They just need to scale back their + armored, or reduce their hps to like 100.
Mules are frustrating as well because you can kill scvs and a terran is still in the game--very annoying.
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Sat Nov 06, 2010 4:51 pm |
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kublikhan
Joined: 11 Jul 2003
Posts: 2849
Location: Schaumburg, IL |
Nestea's zerg play steamrolled the poor terran 4-0. In fact, Nestea did not lose a single match in the entire tournament. Did not see all that much Marauders in the semi's. Terrans seemed to favor heavy marines/banshee/siege play.
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Give me a lever long enough and I shall move the world. - Archimedes
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Sat Nov 06, 2010 8:15 pm |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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quote:
Originally posted by kublikhan
Nestea's zerg play steamrolled the poor terran 4-0. In fact, Nestea did not lose a single match in the entire tournament. Did not see all that much Marauders in the semi's. Terrans seemed to favor heavy marines/banshee/siege play.
I'm moreso speaking in toss vs terran anyways. But marauders do come out if there's a roach heavy army.
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Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:03 am |
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7VlesSiah
Joined: 16 Feb 2001
Posts: 2456
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In my eyes the main problem is Toss. Blizzard has successfully declawed them.
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Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:10 pm |
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Sparkz102
Joined: 27 Feb 2003
Posts: 2999
Location: War2 |
quote:
Originally posted by 7VlesSiah
In my eyes the main problem is Toss. Blizzard has successfully declawed them.
in my eyes the main problem is u think toss is bad, because something about another race is good.
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Sun Nov 07, 2010 4:32 pm |
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Rat
Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 1045
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Messiah didnt u notice the nexus hp buff?
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GreenHorn: Nexus cried every time I beat him but still thought he was better.
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Mon Nov 08, 2010 9:52 am |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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quote:
Originally posted by Sparkz102
quote:
Originally posted by 7VlesSiah
In my eyes the main problem is Toss. Blizzard has successfully declawed them.
in my eyes the main problem is u think toss is bad, because something about another race is good.
I don't think toss is bad. I just don't like the current power of marauders. The cost of them vs the damage they do plus the timing of them seems a bit powerful. I mean, they come out at tier 1.5 and can be hitting your base well before you would have an immortal. Then in order to keep up to marauders you would need 2-3 robotics facilites or switch to colossus (which get rocked by good viking use).
I mean, without a doubt people can beat marauders and do. But I feel marauders are the "void rays" of two patches ago.
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Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:03 pm |
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7VlesSiah
Joined: 16 Feb 2001
Posts: 2456
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I have no problem with certain units being really strong. My problem is that every unit terran has is strong and there aren't any real strong counters to any of them.
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Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:46 pm |
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Kyr.Luoson
Joined: 01 Oct 2008
Posts: 1696
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I think it's because the zealot sucks so badly against just a few maurders chucked in any army
Zealot leg speed should be in the cyber core and 100/100, that would solve the early game problem vs maurders, once you got collosi or templar there not that bad and P is properly more favoured
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Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:03 pm |
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Sypher
Joined: 18 Sep 2000
Posts: 5698
Location: Detroit, MI |
quote:
Originally posted by Kyr.Luoson
I think it's because the zealot sucks so badly against just a few maurders chucked in any army
Zealot leg speed should be in the cyber core and 100/100, that would solve the early game problem vs maurders, once you got collosi or templar there not that bad and P is properly more favoured
or you get a few sentries and make their kiting ineffective.
I think the prob that a lot of toss have vs Terran is that they rush to collosus too fast. If terran does early pressure and picks off a couple gateway units, when your super fast collosus pops, you don't have enough units to protect it.
_________________
"I tend to thougoughly enjoy my encounters significantly more with 120+ types, as I find them more stimulating. 100-110 people are okay too operating at full capacity." - Paper_Boy
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Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:29 am |
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BanMe
Joined: 24 Jul 2003
Posts: 2472
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trying to tune in finals now, gomtv.net is laggy as shit
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 3:03 am |
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Aerasal
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
Posts: 3437
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quote:
Originally posted by Kyr.Luoson
I think it's because the zealot sucks so badly against just a few maurders chucked in any army
Zealot leg speed should be in the cyber core and 100/100, that would solve the early game problem vs maurders, once you got collosi or templar there not that bad and P is properly more favoured
no it shouldn't cuz that upgrade is a massive buff to zealots and makes them effective late game. late game definitely is p favored atm though with good templar use
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 9:19 pm |
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Kyr.Luoson
Joined: 01 Oct 2008
Posts: 1696
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quote:
Originally posted by Aerasal
quote:
Originally posted by Kyr.Luoson
I think it's because the zealot sucks so badly against just a few maurders chucked in any army
Zealot leg speed should be in the cyber core and 100/100, that would solve the early game problem vs maurders, once you got collosi or templar there not that bad and P is properly more favoured
no it shouldn't cuz that upgrade is a massive buff to zealots and makes them effective late game. late game definitely is p favored atm though with good templar use
Effective late game? err the unit it's self is not being suggested to change. It still has the same stats =\
If anything it will balance the upgrades to Terran's cheap shit like 50/50 for shells which are effective against all ground units protoss has bar the colossi.
Also Sypher that's a really newb response, if you haven't noticed alot of maps have back rocks a big choke or the battle happens to be out in the field, force fields in limited number can be useless in certain places and most of the time against an early 3 rax MM push if you dont get a good forcefield off it is instant death reguardless of what else u mirco.
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 9:31 pm |
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Aerasal
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
Posts: 3437
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i shouldn't have said effective because obviously every unit has its uses throughout the game but what i meant was that its such a massive upgrade it makes zealots still really powerful in late game effectively turning a tier 1 unit into a tier 3 unit in terms of power. zealots would obliterate almost everything on the ground early-mid game if the upgrade was on core for only 100 100.
Last edited by Aerasal on Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:20 pm |
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Kyr.Luoson
Joined: 01 Oct 2008
Posts: 1696
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quote:
Originally posted by Aerasal
i just meant its such a massive upgrade it makes zealots still really powerful in late game effectively turning a tier 1 unit into a tier 3 unit. zealots would obliterate almost everything on the ground early-mid game if the upgrade was on core for only 100 100.
Not sure you even play this game dude, did you realise you gotta upgrade warpgate first? It's not goin be a instant upgrade as soon as u get a core..
Also zealots are the weakest tier 1 unit in the game cost for cost and are useless unless u get a lucky forcefield in a corner or ramp against someone who can kite with maurders or roaches.
Zealots with speed are also weak, not sure how you think they become a 'tier3' unit, as said before with maurders you can still kite fairly easy against speedlots
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:25 pm |
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Aerasal
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
Posts: 3437
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quote:
Originally posted by Kyr.Luoson
quote:
Originally posted by Aerasal
i just meant its such a massive upgrade it makes zealots still really powerful in late game effectively turning a tier 1 unit into a tier 3 unit. zealots would obliterate almost everything on the ground early-mid game if the upgrade was on core for only 100 100.
Not sure you even play this game dude, did you realise you gotta upgrade warpgate first? It's not goin be a instant upgrade as soon as u get a core..
Also zealots are the weakest tier 1 unit in the game cost for cost and are useless unless u get a lucky forcefield in a corner or ramp against someone who can kite with maurders or roaches.
Zealots with speed are also weak, not sure how you think they become a 'tier3' unit, as said before with maurders you can still kite fairly easy against speedlots
no i didn't realize you needed to upgrade warp gate i never play toss (i guess you're just saying you wouldn't upgrade that before warpgate?) but thats still pretty early for such a massive upgrade. you would have it quicker than blink stalkers.
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:30 pm |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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Pretty epic games. I don't like how 2/3 games someone won were cheese strats.
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Sat Nov 13, 2010 11:51 pm |
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